"Bi hînbûna zimanekî biyanî, em dikarin karaktera xwe biguherînin"

Psychologies: Dmitry, you once said that language is 10% mathematics and 90% psychology. What did you mean?

Dmitry Petrov: One can argue about proportions, but I can say for sure that the language has two components. One is pure mathematics, the other is pure psychology. Mathematics is a set of basic algorithms, the basic fundamental principles of language structure, a mechanism that I call the language matrix. A kind of multiplication table.

Each language has its own mechanism — this is what distinguishes languages ​​uXNUMXbuXNUMXbfrom each other, but there are also general principles. When mastering a language, it is required to bring the algorithms to automatism, as when mastering some kind of sport, or dancing, or playing a musical instrument. And these are not just grammatical rules, these are the fundamental structures that create speech.

For example, word order. It directly reflects the view of the native speaker of this language on the world.

Do you want to say that by the order in which the parts of speech are placed in a sentence, one can judge the worldview and way of thinking of the people?

Yes. During the Renaissance, for example, some French linguists even saw the superiority of the French language over others, in particular Germanic, in that the French first name the noun and then the adjective that defines it.

They made a debatable, strange for us conclusion that the Frenchman first sees the main thing, the essence — the noun, and then already supplies it with some kind of definition, attribute. For example, if a Russian, an Englishman, a German say «white house», a Frenchman will say «white house».

How complex the rules for arranging the various parts of speech in a sentence (say, the Germans have an intricate but very rigid algorithm) will show us how the corresponding people perceive reality.

If the verb is in the first place, it turns out that action is important for a person in the first place?

By and large, yes. Let’s say Russian and most Slavic languages ​​have free word order. And this is reflected in the way we look at the world, in the way we organize our being.

There are languages ​​with a fixed word order, like English: in this language we will only say “I love you”, and in Russian there are options: “I love you”, “I love you”, “I love you”. Agree, much more variety.

And more confusion, as if we deliberately avoid clarity and system. In my opinion, it is very Russian.

In Russian, with all the flexibility of building language structures, it also has its own “mathematical matrix”. Although the English language really has a clearer structure, which is reflected in the mentality — more orderly, pragmatic. In it, one word is used in the maximum number of meanings. And this is the advantage of the language.

Where a number of additional verbs are required in Russian — for example, we say «to go», «to rise», «to go down», «to return», the Englishman uses one verb «go», which is equipped with a postposition that gives it the direction of movement.

And how does the psychological component manifest itself? It seems to me that even in mathematical psychology there is a lot of psychology, judging by your words.

The second component in linguistics is psycho-emotional, because every language is a way of seeing the world, so when I start teaching a language, I first of all suggest finding some associations.

For one, the Italian language is associated with national cuisine: pizza, pasta. For another, Italy is music. For the third — cinema. There must be some emotional image that binds us to a particular territory.

And then we begin to perceive the language not just as a set of words and a list of grammatical rules, but as a multidimensional space in which we can exist and feel comfortable. And if you want to better understand an Italian, then you need to do it not in universal English (by the way, few people in Italy speak it fluently), but in their native language.

One familiar business coach somehow joked, trying to explain why different peoples and languages ​​were formed. His theory is: God is having fun. Perhaps I agree with him: how else to explain that people strive to communicate, talk, get to know each other better, but as if an obstacle was deliberately invented, a real quest.

But most of the communication takes place between native speakers of the same language. Do they always understand each other? The very fact that we speak the same language does not guarantee us understanding, because each of us puts completely different meanings and emotions into what is said.

Therefore, it is worth learning a foreign language not only because it is an interesting activity for general development, it is an absolutely necessary condition for the survival of man and mankind. There is no such conflict in the modern world — neither armed nor economic — that would not arise because people in some place did not understand each other.

Sometimes completely different things are called with the same word, sometimes, speaking about the same thing, they call the phenomenon with different words. Because of this, wars break out, many troubles arise. Language as a phenomenon is a timid attempt by mankind to find a peaceful way of communication, a way of exchanging information.

But this remedy can never, by definition, be perfect. Therefore, psychology is no less important than knowledge of the language matrix, and I believe that in parallel with its study, it is absolutely necessary to study the mentality, culture, history and traditions of the respective people.

Words convey only a small percentage of the information we exchange. Everything else is context, experience, intonation, gestures, facial expressions.

But for many — you probably often encounter this — a strong fear precisely because of the small vocabulary: if I don’t know enough words, I build the constructions incorrectly, I’m mistaken, then they definitely won’t understand me. We attach more importance to the «mathematics» of the language than to psychology, although, it turns out, it should be the other way around.

There is a happy category of people who, in a good sense, are devoid of an inferiority complex, a mistake complex, who, knowing twenty words, communicate without any problems and achieve everything they need in a foreign country. And this is the best confirmation that in no case should you be afraid to make mistakes. Nobody will laugh at you. That’s not what’s stopping you from communicating.

I have observed a large number of people who have had to be taught in different periods of my teaching life, and I have found that the difficulties in mastering the language have a certain reflection even in human physiology. I have found several points in the human body where tension causes some difficulty in learning a language.

One of them is in the middle of the forehead, the tension there is typical for people who tend to comprehend everything analytically, think a lot before acting.

If you notice this in yourself, it means that you are trying to write some phrase on your “internal monitor” that you are going to express to your interlocutor, but you are afraid to make a mistake, select the right words, cross out, select again. It takes an enormous amount of energy and greatly interferes with communication.

Another point is in the lower part of the neck, at the level of the collarbones. It tenses up not only among those who study the language, but also among those who speak in public — lecturers, actors, vocalists. It seems that he has learned all the words, he knows everything, but as soon as it comes to a conversation, a certain lump appears in his throat. As if something is preventing me from expressing my thoughts.

Our physiology signals that we have a large amount of information, but we find too narrow a channel for its expression: we know and are able to do more than we can say.

And the third point — in the lower part of the abdomen — is tense for those who are shy and think: “What if I say something wrong, what if I don’t understand or they don’t understand me, what if they laugh at me?” The combination, the chain of these points leads to a block, to a state when we lose the ability to a flexible, free exchange of information.

How to get rid of this communication block?

I myself apply and recommend to students, especially those who will work as interpreters, the techniques of proper breathing. I borrowed them from yoga practices.

We take a breath, and as we exhale, we carefully observe where we have tension, and “dissolve”, relax these points. Then a three-dimensional perception of reality appears, not linear, when we “at the input” of the phrase told to us catch word by word, we lose half of them and do not understand, and “at the output” we give out word by word.

We speak not in words, but in semantic units — quanta of information and emotions. We share thoughts. When I start to say something in a language that I speak well, in my native language or in some other language, I don’t know how my sentence will end — there are just thoughts that I want to convey to you.

Words are attendants. And that is why the main algorithms, the matrix should be brought to automatism. In order not to look back at them constantly, each time opening his mouth.

How big is the language matrix? What does it consist of — verb forms, nouns?

These are the most popular forms of the verb, because even if there are dozens of different forms in the language, there are three or four that are used all the time. And be sure to take into account the criterion of frequency — both with regard to vocabulary and grammar.

Many people lose their enthusiasm for learning a language when they see how diverse grammar is. But it is not necessary to memorize everything that is in the dictionary.

I was interested in your idea that language and its structure affect the mentality. Does the reverse process take place? How does the language and its structure, for example, affect the political system in a particular country?

The fact is that the map of languages ​​and mentalities does not coincide with the political map of the world. We understand that the division into states is the result of wars, revolutions, some kind of agreements between peoples. Languages ​​smoothly pass one into another, there are no clear boundaries between them.

Some general patterns can be identified. For example, in the languages ​​of countries with less stable economies, including Russia, Greece, Italy, the impersonal words “must”, “need” are often used, while in the languages ​​of Northern Europe there are no such words.

You will not find in any dictionary how to translate the Russian word “necessary” into English in one word, because it does not fit into the English mentality. In English, you need to name the subject: who owes, who needs?

In Russian or Italian, we can say: «We need to build a road.» In English it is «You must» or «I must» or «We must build». It turns out that the British find and determine the person responsible for this or that action. Or in Spanish, like in Russian, we’ll say «Tu me gustas» (I like you). The subject is the one who likes.

And in the English sentence, the analogue is «I like you». That is, the main person in English is the one who likes someone. On the one hand, this manifests greater discipline and maturity, and on the other, greater egocentrism. These are just two simple examples, but they already show the difference in the approach to life of Russians, Spaniards and the British, their outlook on the world and themselves in this world.

It turns out that if we take up a language, then our thinking, our worldview will inevitably change? Probably, it is possible to select a language for learning in accordance with the desired qualities?

When a person, having mastered a language, uses it and is in a language environment, he undoubtedly acquires new characteristics. When I speak Italian, my hands turn on, my gestures are much more active than when I speak German. I become more emotional. And if you constantly live in such an atmosphere, then sooner or later it becomes yours.

My colleagues and I noticed that students of linguistic universities who studied German are more disciplined and pedantic. But those who have studied French like to engage in amateur activities, they have a more creative approach to life and study. By the way, those who studied English drank more often: the British are in the top 3 most drinking nations.

I think that China has risen to such economic heights also thanks to its language: from an early age, Chinese children learn a huge number of characters, and this requires incredible thoroughness, painstaking, perseverance and the ability to notice details.

Need a language that builds courage? Learn Russian or, for example, Chechen. Do you want to find tenderness, emotionality, sensitivity? Italian. Passion — Spanish. English teaches pragmatism. German — pedantry and sentimentality, because the burgher is the most sentimental creature in the world. Turkish will develop militancy, but also the talent to bargain, negotiate.

Is everyone able to learn a foreign language or do you need to have some special talents for this?

Language as a means of communication is available to any person in their right mind. A person who speaks his native language, by definition, is able to speak another: he has all the necessary arsenal of means. It is a myth that some are capable and some are not. Whether or not there is motivation is another matter.

When we educate children, it should not be accompanied by violence, which can cause rejection. All the good things that we learned in life, we received with pleasure, right? We learn language for two purposes — for pleasure and for freedom. And each new language gives a new degree of freedom.

Language learning has been cited as a surefire cure for dementia and Alzheimer’s, according to recent research*. And why not Sudoku or, for example, chess, what do you think?

I think any brain work is useful. It’s just that learning a language is a more versatile tool than solving crossword puzzles or playing chess, at least because there are much fewer fans of playing games and choosing words than those who at least studied some foreign language at school.

But in the modern world, we need different forms of brain training, because, unlike previous generations, we delegate many of our mental functions to computers and smartphones. Previously, each of us knew dozens of phone numbers by heart, but now we cannot get to the nearest store without a navigator.

Once upon a time, the human ancestor had a tail, when they stopped using this tail, it fell off. Recently, we have been witnessing a total degradation of human memory. Because every day, with every generation of new technologies, we delegate more and more functions to gadgets, wonderful devices that are created to help us, relieve us of an extra load, but they gradually take away our own powers that cannot be given away.

Learning a language in this series is one of the first places, if not the first, as one of the possible means of counteracting memory degradation: after all, in order to memorize language constructs, and even more so to speak, we need to use a variety of parts of the brain.

^* In 2004, Ellen Bialystok, PhD, a psychologist at York University in Toronto, and her colleagues compared the cognitive abilities of older bilinguals and monolinguals. The results showed that knowledge of two languages ​​can delay the decline in cognitive activity of the brain for 4-5 years.